Discussion:
Thousands of murdered babies found in Obama state Illinois home to be buried in Indiana, officials say
(too old to reply)
Scrape and suck
2020-02-13 10:48:06 UTC
Permalink
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.

Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.

The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.

Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.

He was a reviled figure among anti-abortion activists, who held
weekly demonstrations outside his clinics, sometimes blocking
entryways.

Hill, a Republican seeking a second term as attorney general,
has put his defense of state laws tightening abortion
restrictions at the forefront of his campaign for another term.
Abortion opponents heralded Hill's role in making the burial
happen.

"I'm so grateful that, finally, the bodies of these little boys
and girls will be treated with the dignity they deserved," said
Cathie Humbarger, who heads Right to Life in northeast Indiana.

Indiana is one of just a few states with a law mandating burial
or cremation of fetal remains after abortions. The law did not
take immediate effect because of court challenges after then-
Gov. Mike Pence signed it into law in 2016. A U.S. Supreme Court
ruling in May upheld the law.

Planned Parenthood officials have long expressed concerns that
such laws will reduce women's access to abortion by increasing
costs to clinics.

Klopfer's career started unraveling in the early 2000s with a
flurry of complaints, including that he performed an abortion on
a 10-year-old girl raped by her uncle and did not notify law
enforcement.

His career effectively ended in 2016, when authorities suspended
his medical license, citing, among other things, shoddy post-op
monitoring of his patients. Klopfer complained that conservative
state officials were in cahoots with anti-abortion groups to
close him down.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/fetuses-found-illinois-home-buried-
indiana
Attila
2020-02-13 12:35:53 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 11:48:06 +0100 (CET), "Scrape and suck"
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
Were any laws broken or did the AG just grab a chance for publicity?
Post by Scrape and suck
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
He was a reviled figure among anti-abortion activists, who held
weekly demonstrations outside his clinics, sometimes blocking
entryways.
Isn't such activity a violation of the law? Were they arrested?
Post by Scrape and suck
Hill, a Republican seeking a second term as attorney general,
has put his defense of state laws tightening abortion
restrictions at the forefront of his campaign for another term.
Abortion opponents heralded Hill's role in making the burial
happen.
"I'm so grateful that, finally, the bodies of these little boys
and girls will be treated with the dignity they deserved," said
Cathie Humbarger, who heads Right to Life in northeast Indiana.
A fetus is neither a little boy or a little girl but saying so makes a
great sound byte.

Propaganda you know.
Post by Scrape and suck
Indiana is one of just a few states with a law mandating burial
or cremation of fetal remains after abortions. The law did not
take immediate effect because of court challenges after then-
Gov. Mike Pence signed it into law in 2016. A U.S. Supreme Court
ruling in May upheld the law.
That should not be much of a problem since burning should be standard
for disposable human waste.
Post by Scrape and suck
Planned Parenthood officials have long expressed concerns that
such laws will reduce women's access to abortion by increasing
costs to clinics.
Which was the intent of the law, of course.
Post by Scrape and suck
Klopfer's career started unraveling in the early 2000s with a
flurry of complaints, including that he performed an abortion on
a 10-year-old girl raped by her uncle and did not notify law
enforcement.
He should have. Statutory rape is illegal.
Post by Scrape and suck
His career effectively ended in 2016, when authorities suspended
his medical license, citing, among other things, shoddy post-op
monitoring of his patients. Klopfer complained that conservative
state officials were in cahoots with anti-abortion groups to
close him down.
Were they?
Post by Scrape and suck
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
https://www.foxnews.com/us/fetuses-found-illinois-home-buried-
indiana
The subject line is clearly wrong since abortion is legal in Illinois
and murder is illegal. An abortion cannot be murder and all babies
have been born alive.
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
BeamMeUpScotty
2020-02-13 15:28:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 11:48:06 +0100 (CET), "Scrape and suck"
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
Were any laws broken or did the AG just grab a chance for publicity?
Post by Scrape and suck
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
He was a reviled figure among anti-abortion activists, who held
weekly demonstrations outside his clinics, sometimes blocking
entryways.
Isn't such activity a violation of the law? Were they arrested?
Post by Scrape and suck
Hill, a Republican seeking a second term as attorney general,
has put his defense of state laws tightening abortion
restrictions at the forefront of his campaign for another term.
Abortion opponents heralded Hill's role in making the burial
happen.
"I'm so grateful that, finally, the bodies of these little boys
and girls will be treated with the dignity they deserved," said
Cathie Humbarger, who heads Right to Life in northeast Indiana.
A fetus is neither a little boy or a little girl but saying so makes a
great sound byte.
Propaganda you know.
They are a little gestating human life.... NO matter what other
descriptors you apply.
--
That's Karma

*One man's Affirmative Action law is another man's Jim Crow law*
Attila
2020-02-13 15:40:13 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:28:58 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 11:48:06 +0100 (CET), "Scrape and suck"
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
Were any laws broken or did the AG just grab a chance for publicity?
Post by Scrape and suck
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
He was a reviled figure among anti-abortion activists, who held
weekly demonstrations outside his clinics, sometimes blocking
entryways.
Isn't such activity a violation of the law? Were they arrested?
Post by Scrape and suck
Hill, a Republican seeking a second term as attorney general,
has put his defense of state laws tightening abortion
restrictions at the forefront of his campaign for another term.
Abortion opponents heralded Hill's role in making the burial
happen.
"I'm so grateful that, finally, the bodies of these little boys
and girls will be treated with the dignity they deserved," said
Cathie Humbarger, who heads Right to Life in northeast Indiana.
A fetus is neither a little boy or a little girl but saying so makes a
great sound byte.
Propaganda you know.
They are a little gestating human life.... NO matter what other
descriptors you apply.
Irrelevant. It is not a human being but only a potential human being.
Just as an egg is not a chicken but only a potential chicken.

My comments are all valid and correct.
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
BeamMeUpScotty
2020-02-13 16:49:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:28:58 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 11:48:06 +0100 (CET), "Scrape and suck"
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
Were any laws broken or did the AG just grab a chance for publicity?
Post by Scrape and suck
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
He was a reviled figure among anti-abortion activists, who held
weekly demonstrations outside his clinics, sometimes blocking
entryways.
Isn't such activity a violation of the law? Were they arrested?
Post by Scrape and suck
Hill, a Republican seeking a second term as attorney general,
has put his defense of state laws tightening abortion
restrictions at the forefront of his campaign for another term.
Abortion opponents heralded Hill's role in making the burial
happen.
"I'm so grateful that, finally, the bodies of these little boys
and girls will be treated with the dignity they deserved," said
Cathie Humbarger, who heads Right to Life in northeast Indiana.
A fetus is neither a little boy or a little girl but saying so makes a
great sound byte.
Propaganda you know.
They are a little gestating human life.... NO matter what other
descriptors you apply.
Irrelevant. It is not a human being but only a potential human being.
Just as an egg is not a chicken but only a potential chicken.
My comments are all valid and correct.
You're all knowing and all seeing?

You know when a human life is a human being? And you're sure it's NOT
that they are a human being at conception and are a gestating human
being? And you have scientific proof? And you have scientific proof
that you're doing no harm when you kill a HUMAN LIFE that you say is NOT
a human being "yet". At what moment is it a HUMAN BEING... and why is
that moment significant to the scientific proof?

If YOU HAVE NO SCIENTIFIC PROOF then killing one may be murder, all be
it legalized by Democrats, it's murder even if the government ignores
it. Like HONOR KILLINGS in the Middle East where the government may
look the other way and allow it for religious reasons. The fact they are
killing someone for Allah and the FAMILY NAME doesn't make it any less
of a murder.

Renaming a murder doesn't make it scientifically different.
--
That's Karma

*One man's Affirmative Action law is another man's Jim Crow law*
Attila
2020-02-13 20:41:22 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 11:49:51 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:28:58 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 11:48:06 +0100 (CET), "Scrape and suck"
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
Were any laws broken or did the AG just grab a chance for publicity?
Post by Scrape and suck
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
He was a reviled figure among anti-abortion activists, who held
weekly demonstrations outside his clinics, sometimes blocking
entryways.
Isn't such activity a violation of the law? Were they arrested?
Post by Scrape and suck
Hill, a Republican seeking a second term as attorney general,
has put his defense of state laws tightening abortion
restrictions at the forefront of his campaign for another term.
Abortion opponents heralded Hill's role in making the burial
happen.
"I'm so grateful that, finally, the bodies of these little boys
and girls will be treated with the dignity they deserved," said
Cathie Humbarger, who heads Right to Life in northeast Indiana.
A fetus is neither a little boy or a little girl but saying so makes a
great sound byte.
Propaganda you know.
They are a little gestating human life.... NO matter what other
descriptors you apply.
Irrelevant. It is not a human being but only a potential human being.
Just as an egg is not a chicken but only a potential chicken.
My comments are all valid and correct.
You're all knowing and all seeing?
Not at all.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
You know when a human life is a human being?
I know when it isn't.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And you're sure it's NOT
that they are a human being at conception and are a gestating human
being? And you have scientific proof?
That is not something that is determined by science. It is defined by
the law and society.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And you have scientific proof
that you're doing no harm when you kill a HUMAN LIFE that you say is NOT
a human being "yet". At what moment is it a HUMAN BEING... and why is
that moment significant to the scientific proof?
It becomes a human being when it survives live birth and science has
nothing to do with it. Science defines the species and nothing else.

A human being can own property, be counted in a census, be a citizen,
pay taxes, and inherit. A fetus prior to live birth can do none of
those things.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If YOU HAVE NO SCIENTIFIC PROOF then killing one may be murder, all be
it legalized by Democrats, it's murder even if the government ignores it.
Again. science is not involved. Murder is a legal term with specific
legal requirements, one major requirement is the act must be illegal.
Since abortion is legal it is not possible for it to be murder since a
legal act cannot be illegal. Politics have nothing to do with it.

I am a Republican who supports the freedom of choice and opposes the
public involvement with religion in any form including special tax
breaks.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Like HONOR KILLINGS in the Middle East where the government may
look the other way and allow it for religious reasons. The fact they are
killing someone for Allah and the FAMILY NAME doesn't make it any less
of a murder.
That would depend on the local laws would it not? I agree the habit
is deplorable and is an excellent example of superstition running amok
but the legality or illegality of the act depends on the local laws.

After all there are local laws against women driving automobiles and
religious police and religious courts to enforce religious laws in
some countries (among other things) and I consider them all equally
barbaric and medieval.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Renaming a murder doesn't make it scientifically different.
Science is irrelevant. Is a speed limit a matter of science? It is a
legal restriction just as murder is a legal restriction.
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
BeamMeUpScotty
2020-02-13 15:10:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new horror
that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals are supplying
those women with counseling and a safe space and a blanket and warm
cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like they do when those same
women are voting for Hillary and Hillary loses? Or do you suppose
learning that your abortion doctor was a doctor Frankenstein and your
baby a victim that lingering, preserved in some jar in a garage
somewhere in Indiana.

Democrats must be so proud.
--
That's Karma

*One man's Affirmative Action law is another man's Jim Crow law*
Attila
2020-02-13 15:41:25 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new horror
that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals are supplying
those women with counseling and a safe space and a blanket and warm
cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like they do when those same
women are voting for Hillary and Hillary loses? Or do you suppose
learning that your abortion doctor was a doctor Frankenstein and your
baby a victim that lingering, preserved in some jar in a garage
somewhere in Indiana.
There is no baby prior to live birth. That is why it is called a
fetus.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Democrats must be so proud.
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
Attila
2020-02-13 15:42:03 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new horror
that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals are supplying
those women with counseling and a safe space and a blanket and warm
cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like they do when those same
women are voting for Hillary and Hillary loses? Or do you suppose
learning that your abortion doctor was a doctor Frankenstein and your
baby a victim that lingering, preserved in some jar in a garage
somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
BeamMeUpScotty
2020-02-13 17:17:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new horror
that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals are supplying
those women with counseling and a safe space and a blanket and warm
cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like they do when those same
women are voting for Hillary and Hillary loses? Or do you suppose
learning that your abortion doctor was a doctor Frankenstein and your
baby a victim that lingering, preserved in some jar in a garage
somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
I didn't say any different..... but Republicans in office didn't vote to
kill human life inside the uterus. Those were Democrats, right or wrong
they decided to do it regardless.

If you think you can justify your beliefs you can call yourself what
ever you want. I have no problem with you believing you're a Republican
but you have to know that just as believing that a human life is
disposable, you may be just as wrong believing you're a Republican.

Because most I have met, actually respect human life, and tend to
protect it.

I don't say you have to be religious or believe everything that every
Republican believes, since I'm a QUASI Libertarian and I have no god, or
God has no interest in me. But I do believe in life, all of it. As a
Libertarian I don't agree with everything LIBERTARIAN so I tend to be a
Constitutional-Libertarian where I use what is Libertarian that will
work under this United States Constitution, and murdering a human life
just isn't Constitutional. Freedom and RIGHTS can only extend to a
point where they infringe on other people's freedom and RIGHTS. And the
RIGHT to LIFE, LIBERTY and the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS/Property are very
clearly what the Revolutionary War and the resulting Constitution were
based on.

While there is no guarantee of wealth or property, the guarantee that
LIFE and LIBERTY are ours is pretty clear, as long as ours doesn't
infringe on others. And the baby in a uterus isn't infringing on the
life of the mother until she is dying. And as for Liberty, it's the same
as life, neither has more RIGHT to it than the other and since they will
be free of one another in 9 months it's a stalemate until the birth
allows them to go in different directions.

It's NOT perfect, but then what is?
--
That's Karma

*One man's Affirmative Action law is another man's Jim Crow law*
Attila
2020-02-13 20:56:57 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 12:17:17 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new horror
that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals are supplying
those women with counseling and a safe space and a blanket and warm
cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like they do when those same
women are voting for Hillary and Hillary loses? Or do you suppose
learning that your abortion doctor was a doctor Frankenstein and your
baby a victim that lingering, preserved in some jar in a garage
somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
I didn't say any different..... but Republicans in office didn't vote to
kill human life inside the uterus.
All human beings have been born alive. Can you give a reference to a
definition of human being that includes a fetus?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Those were Democrats, right or wrong
they decided to do it regardless.
Right and wrong have no intrinsic values and will change from person
to person and over time.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If you think you can justify your beliefs you can call yourself what
ever you want. I have no problem with you believing you're a Republican
but you have to know that just as believing that a human life is
disposable, you may be just as wrong believing you're a Republican.
Or not. I support Trump, voted fro him, and have voted for
Republicans for over half a century but that does not mean I agree
with or support all of their positions. I have supported the Freedom
of Choice since long before 1973.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Because most I have met, actually respect human life, and tend to
protect it.
Are humans an endangered species?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
I don't say you have to be religious or believe everything that every
Republican believes, since I'm a QUASI Libertarian and I have no god, or
God has no interest in me. But I do believe in life, all of it. As a
Libertarian I don't agree with everything LIBERTARIAN so I tend to be a
Constitutional-Libertarian where I use what is Libertarian that will
work under this United States Constitution, and murdering a human life
just isn't Constitutional.
Only illegally killing a person is murder. It is not murder to kill
a fetus (except under certain restrictions) or any human tissue
sample.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Freedom and RIGHTS can only extend to a
point where they infringe on other people's freedom and RIGHTS.
How about the freedom and rights of the woman involved? After all she
is hers now and there is nothing potential or developing about that.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the
RIGHT to LIFE, LIBERTY and the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS/Property are very
clearly what the Revolutionary War and the resulting Constitution were
based on.
That phrase was in the D of C and they were not included in the
Constitution at the obvious option of those who wrote the
Constitution.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
While there is no guarantee of wealth or property, the guarantee that
LIFE and LIBERTY are ours is pretty clear, as long as ours doesn't
infringe on others.
Oh? our laws are based on the Constitution and none at all are based
upon the D of I. Where in the Constitution are life and liberty
guaranteed?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the baby in a uterus isn't infringing on the
life of the mother until she is dying.
: The dangers involved with pregnancy include but are not limited to:
:
: Death
: Abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
: Pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged
: former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers,
: associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and
: reduced quality of life)
: Scarring from episiotomy or c-section
: Increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
: Loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Embolism
:
: Temporary adverse effects
:
: Exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
: altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
: Nausea and vomiting
: Dizziness and light-headedness
: Bloating and attendant discomfort
: Hemmorhoids
: Cramps
: Acne and mild skin disorders
: Skin discoloration, particularly face and abdomen
: Mild to severe backache and strain
: Increased headaches
: Difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
: Increased urination and incontinence
: Breast pain and discharge
: Swelling of joints, and attendant discomfort or pain
: Difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
: Inability to take regular medications
: Shortness of breath
: Higher blood pressure
: Hair loss
: Tendency to anemia
: Infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
: (pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant
: women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
: Curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
: Hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
: Extreme pain on delivery
: Continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period, exacerbated if
: c-section (major surgery) is required, sometimes taking up to a full
: year to fully recover
:
: Occasional complications and side effects
:
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Severe scarring requiring later surgery, esp. after additional
: pregnancies
: Dropped uterus, esp. with additional pregnancies
: Pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication of
: pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of
: pregnancies)
: Eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of
: death)
: Gestational diabetes
: Placenta previa
: Anemia (which can be life-threatening)
: Thrombocytopenic purpura
: Severe cramping
: Embolism (blood clots)
: Medical disability requiring full bed rest, frequently ordered during
: part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of
: either mother or baby
: Torn abdominal muscles
: Mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
: Serious infection and disease, e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis
: Hormonal imbalance
: Ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
: Broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
: Hemorrhage
: Refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
: Aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions, e.g. epilepsy is
: present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug
: metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the
: number and frequency of seizures
: Severe post-partum depression and psychosis
:
: Some less common (and serious) complications
:
: Peripartum cardiomyopathy
: Cardiopulmonary arrest
: Magnesium toxicity
: Severe hypoxemia/acidosis
: Massive embolism
: increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
: Molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease (like a
: pregnancy-induced cancer)
: Malignant arrhythmia
: Circulatory collapse
: Placental abruption
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And as for Liberty, it's the same
as life, neither has more RIGHT to it than the other and since they will
be free of one another in 9 months it's a stalemate until the birth
allows them to go in different directions.
The issue exists now and will totally change if the pregnancy no
longer exists for any reason whatsoever.

It is much like a criminal trial when the defendant dies before the
trial concludes. Do you continue to try a corpse?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
It's NOT perfect, but then what is?
Blocking a simple and safe medical procedure is not the answer to much
of anything other than blind obstinance.
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
atheist
2020-02-14 06:19:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 12:17:17 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new
horror that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals
are supplying those women with counseling and a safe space and a
blanket and warm cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like
they do when those same women are voting for Hillary and Hillary
loses? Or do you suppose learning that your abortion doctor was a
doctor Frankenstein and your baby a victim that lingering,
preserved in some jar in a garage somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
I didn't say any different..... but Republicans in office didn't vote
to kill human life inside the uterus.
All human beings have been born alive. Can you give a reference to a
definition of human being that includes a fetus?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Those were Democrats, right or wrong
they decided to do it regardless.
Right and wrong have no intrinsic values and will change from person
to person and over time.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If you think you can justify your beliefs you can call yourself what
ever you want. I have no problem with you believing you're a
Republican but you have to know that just as believing that a human
life is disposable, you may be just as wrong believing you're a
Republican.
Or not. I support Trump, voted fro him, and have voted for
Republicans for over half a century but that does not mean I agree
with or support all of their positions. I have supported the Freedom
of Choice since long before 1973.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Because most I have met, actually respect human life, and tend to
protect it.
Are humans an endangered species?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
I don't say you have to be religious or believe everything that every
Republican believes, since I'm a QUASI Libertarian and I have no god,
or God has no interest in me. But I do believe in life, all of it.
As a Libertarian I don't agree with everything LIBERTARIAN so I tend
to be a Constitutional-Libertarian where I use what is Libertarian
that will work under this United States Constitution, and murdering a
human life just isn't Constitutional.
Only illegally killing a person is murder. It is not murder to kill
a fetus (except under certain restrictions) or any human tissue
sample.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Freedom and RIGHTS can only extend to a
point where they infringe on other people's freedom and RIGHTS.
How about the freedom and rights of the woman involved? After all she
is hers now and there is nothing potential or developing about that.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the
RIGHT to LIFE, LIBERTY and the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS/Property are very
clearly what the Revolutionary War and the resulting Constitution were
based on.
That phrase was in the D of C and they were not included in the
Constitution at the obvious option of those who wrote the
Constitution.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
While there is no guarantee of wealth or property, the guarantee that
LIFE and LIBERTY are ours is pretty clear, as long as ours doesn't
infringe on others.
Oh? our laws are based on the Constitution and none at all are based
upon the D of I. Where in the Constitution are life and liberty
guaranteed?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the baby in a uterus isn't infringing on the
life of the mother until she is dying.
: Death
: Abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
: Pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged
: former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers,
: associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and
: reduced quality of life)
: Scarring from episiotomy or c-section
: Increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
: Loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Embolism
: Temporary adverse effects
: Exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
: altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
: Nausea and vomiting
: Dizziness and light-headedness
: Bloating and attendant discomfort
: Hemmorhoids
: Cramps
: Acne and mild skin disorders
: Skin discoloration, particularly face and abdomen
: Mild to severe backache and strain
: Increased headaches
: Difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
: Increased urination and incontinence
: Breast pain and discharge
: Swelling of joints, and attendant discomfort or pain
: Difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
: Inability to take regular medications
: Shortness of breath
: Higher blood pressure
: Hair loss
: Tendency to anemia
: Infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
: (pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant
: women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
: Curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
: Hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
: Extreme pain on delivery
: Continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period, exacerbated if
: c-section (major surgery) is required, sometimes taking up to a full
: year to fully recover
: Occasional complications and side effects
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Severe scarring requiring later surgery, esp. after additional
: pregnancies
: Dropped uterus, esp. with additional pregnancies
: Pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication
: of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of
: pregnancies)
: Eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of
: death)
: Gestational diabetes
: Placenta previa
: Anemia (which can be life-threatening)
: Thrombocytopenic purpura
: Severe cramping
: Embolism (blood clots)
: Medical disability requiring full bed rest, frequently ordered during
: part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of
: either mother or baby
: Torn abdominal muscles
: Mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
: Serious infection and disease, e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis
: Hormonal imbalance
: Ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
: Broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
: Hemorrhage
: Refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
: Aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions, e.g. epilepsy
: is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug
: metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the
: number and frequency of seizures
: Severe post-partum depression and psychosis
: Some less common (and serious) complications
: Peripartum cardiomyopathy
: Cardiopulmonary arrest
: Magnesium toxicity
: Severe hypoxemia/acidosis
: Massive embolism
: increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
: Molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease (like a
: pregnancy-induced cancer)
: Malignant arrhythmia
: Circulatory collapse
: Placental abruption
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And as for Liberty, it's the same
as life, neither has more RIGHT to it than the other and since they
will be free of one another in 9 months it's a stalemate until the
birth allows them to go in different directions.
The issue exists now and will totally change if the pregnancy no
longer exists for any reason whatsoever.
Why should we give some stupid people a free pass on personal
responsibility?
Post by Attila
It is much like a criminal trial when the defendant dies before the
trial concludes. Do you continue to try a corpse?
If you want to put it that way, the first abortion is free, the second is
too as long as both parties submit to sterilization and are ineligible for
welfare and drug rehab funds for 12 months following the abortion.
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
It's NOT perfect, but then what is?
Blocking a simple and safe medical procedure is not the answer to much
of anything other than blind obstinance.
It's not a medical procedure. It's mass murder on a scale far above gun
violence. Abortion is a crime against humanity.
a322x1n
2020-02-14 06:11:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 12:17:17 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new
horror that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals
are supplying those women with counseling and a safe space and a
blanket and warm cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like
they do when those same women are voting for Hillary and Hillary
loses? Or do you suppose learning that your abortion doctor was a
doctor Frankenstein and your baby a victim that lingering,
preserved in some jar in a garage somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
I didn't say any different..... but Republicans in office didn't vote
to kill human life inside the uterus.
All human beings have been born alive. Can you give a reference to a
definition of human being that includes a fetus?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Those were Democrats, right or wrong
they decided to do it regardless.
Right and wrong have no intrinsic values and will change from person
to person and over time.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If you think you can justify your beliefs you can call yourself what
ever you want. I have no problem with you believing you're a
Republican but you have to know that just as believing that a human
life is disposable, you may be just as wrong believing you're a
Republican.
Or not. I support Trump, voted fro him, and have voted for
Republicans for over half a century but that does not mean I agree
with or support all of their positions. I have supported the Freedom
of Choice since long before 1973.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Because most I have met, actually respect human life, and tend to
protect it.
Are humans an endangered species?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
I don't say you have to be religious or believe everything that every
Republican believes, since I'm a QUASI Libertarian and I have no god,
or God has no interest in me. But I do believe in life, all of it.
As a Libertarian I don't agree with everything LIBERTARIAN so I tend
to be a Constitutional-Libertarian where I use what is Libertarian
that will work under this United States Constitution, and murdering a
human life just isn't Constitutional.
Only illegally killing a person is murder. It is not murder to kill
a fetus (except under certain restrictions) or any human tissue
sample.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Freedom and RIGHTS can only extend to a
point where they infringe on other people's freedom and RIGHTS.
How about the freedom and rights of the woman involved? After all
she is hers now and there is nothing potential or developing about
that.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the
RIGHT to LIFE, LIBERTY and the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS/Property are very
clearly what the Revolutionary War and the resulting Constitution
were based on.
That phrase was in the D of C and they were not included in the
Constitution at the obvious option of those who wrote the
Constitution.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
While there is no guarantee of wealth or property, the guarantee that
LIFE and LIBERTY are ours is pretty clear, as long as ours doesn't
infringe on others.
Oh? our laws are based on the Constitution and none at all are based
upon the D of I. Where in the Constitution are life and liberty
guaranteed?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the baby in a uterus isn't infringing on the
life of the mother until she is dying.
: Death
: Abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
: Pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged
: former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers,
: associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and
: reduced quality of life)
: Scarring from episiotomy or c-section
: Increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
: Loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Embolism
: Temporary adverse effects
: Exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
: altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
: Nausea and vomiting
: Dizziness and light-headedness
: Bloating and attendant discomfort
: Hemmorhoids
: Cramps
: Acne and mild skin disorders
: Skin discoloration, particularly face and abdomen
: Mild to severe backache and strain
: Increased headaches
: Difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
: Increased urination and incontinence
: Breast pain and discharge
: Swelling of joints, and attendant discomfort or pain
: Difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
: Inability to take regular medications
: Shortness of breath
: Higher blood pressure
: Hair loss
: Tendency to anemia
: Infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
: (pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant
: women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other
: diseases) Curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and
: activities Hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum
: depression Extreme pain on delivery
: Continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period, exacerbated if
: c-section (major surgery) is required, sometimes taking up to a full
: year to fully recover
: Occasional complications and side effects
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Severe scarring requiring later surgery, esp. after additional
: pregnancies
: Dropped uterus, esp. with additional pregnancies
: Pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication
: of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of
: pregnancies)
: Eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of
: death)
: Gestational diabetes
: Placenta previa
: Anemia (which can be life-threatening)
: Thrombocytopenic purpura
: Severe cramping
: Embolism (blood clots)
: Medical disability requiring full bed rest, frequently ordered
: during part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for
: health of either mother or baby
: Torn abdominal muscles
: Mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
: Serious infection and disease, e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis
: Hormonal imbalance
: Ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
: Broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
: Hemorrhage
: Refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
: Aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions, e.g. epilepsy
: is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug
: metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the
: number and frequency of seizures
: Severe post-partum depression and psychosis
: Some less common (and serious) complications
: Peripartum cardiomyopathy
: Cardiopulmonary arrest
: Magnesium toxicity
: Severe hypoxemia/acidosis
: Massive embolism
: increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
: Molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease (like a
: pregnancy-induced cancer)
: Malignant arrhythmia
: Circulatory collapse
: Placental abruption
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And as for Liberty, it's the same
as life, neither has more RIGHT to it than the other and since they
will be free of one another in 9 months it's a stalemate until the
birth allows them to go in different directions.
The issue exists now and will totally change if the pregnancy no
longer exists for any reason whatsoever.
Why should we give some stupid people a free pass on personal
responsibility?
Post by Attila
It is much like a criminal trial when the defendant dies before the
trial concludes. Do you continue to try a corpse?
If you want to put it that way, the first abortion is free, the second
is too as long as both parties submit to sterilization and are
ineligible for welfare and drug rehab funds for 12 months following
the abortion.
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
It's NOT perfect, but then what is?
Blocking a simple and safe medical procedure is not the answer to
much of anything other than blind obstinance.
It's not a medical procedure. It's mass murder on a scale far above
gun violence. Abortion is a crime against humanity.
Bull shit! Abortion is the most wonderful, decent, wholesome thing that
can be done to fetus filth. Abortion stops fetus filth from becoming
child filth!

Baby, bad. Abortion, beautiful.
Siri Cruise
2020-02-14 07:14:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by a322x1n
Post by atheist
Why should we give some stupid people a free pass on personal
responsibility?
Baby, bad. Abortion, beautiful.
How about we come up with a list of personal responsiblities.
Give consequences for people who fail in their responsibilities.
We can put this list in books. What should we call these books?
List Assessing Worth Books?
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted. @
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' /|\
The first law of discordiamism: The more energy This post / \
to make order is nore energy made into entropy. insults Islam. Mohammed
Attila
2020-02-14 08:01:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 12:17:17 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new
horror that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals
are supplying those women with counseling and a safe space and a
blanket and warm cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like
they do when those same women are voting for Hillary and Hillary
loses? Or do you suppose learning that your abortion doctor was a
doctor Frankenstein and your baby a victim that lingering,
preserved in some jar in a garage somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
I didn't say any different..... but Republicans in office didn't vote
to kill human life inside the uterus.
All human beings have been born alive. Can you give a reference to a
definition of human being that includes a fetus?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Those were Democrats, right or wrong
they decided to do it regardless.
Right and wrong have no intrinsic values and will change from person
to person and over time.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If you think you can justify your beliefs you can call yourself what
ever you want. I have no problem with you believing you're a
Republican but you have to know that just as believing that a human
life is disposable, you may be just as wrong believing you're a
Republican.
Or not. I support Trump, voted fro him, and have voted for
Republicans for over half a century but that does not mean I agree
with or support all of their positions. I have supported the Freedom
of Choice since long before 1973.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Because most I have met, actually respect human life, and tend to
protect it.
Are humans an endangered species?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
I don't say you have to be religious or believe everything that every
Republican believes, since I'm a QUASI Libertarian and I have no god,
or God has no interest in me. But I do believe in life, all of it.
As a Libertarian I don't agree with everything LIBERTARIAN so I tend
to be a Constitutional-Libertarian where I use what is Libertarian
that will work under this United States Constitution, and murdering a
human life just isn't Constitutional.
Only illegally killing a person is murder. It is not murder to kill
a fetus (except under certain restrictions) or any human tissue
sample.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Freedom and RIGHTS can only extend to a
point where they infringe on other people's freedom and RIGHTS.
How about the freedom and rights of the woman involved? After all she
is hers now and there is nothing potential or developing about that.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the
RIGHT to LIFE, LIBERTY and the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS/Property are very
clearly what the Revolutionary War and the resulting Constitution were
based on.
That phrase was in the D of C and they were not included in the
Constitution at the obvious option of those who wrote the
Constitution.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
While there is no guarantee of wealth or property, the guarantee that
LIFE and LIBERTY are ours is pretty clear, as long as ours doesn't
infringe on others.
Oh? our laws are based on the Constitution and none at all are based
upon the D of I. Where in the Constitution are life and liberty
guaranteed?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the baby in a uterus isn't infringing on the
life of the mother until she is dying.
: Death
: Abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
: Pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged
: former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers,
: associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and
: reduced quality of life)
: Scarring from episiotomy or c-section
: Increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
: Loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Embolism
: Temporary adverse effects
: Exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
: altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
: Nausea and vomiting
: Dizziness and light-headedness
: Bloating and attendant discomfort
: Hemmorhoids
: Cramps
: Acne and mild skin disorders
: Skin discoloration, particularly face and abdomen
: Mild to severe backache and strain
: Increased headaches
: Difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
: Increased urination and incontinence
: Breast pain and discharge
: Swelling of joints, and attendant discomfort or pain
: Difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
: Inability to take regular medications
: Shortness of breath
: Higher blood pressure
: Hair loss
: Tendency to anemia
: Infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
: (pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant
: women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
: Curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
: Hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
: Extreme pain on delivery
: Continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period, exacerbated if
: c-section (major surgery) is required, sometimes taking up to a full
: year to fully recover
: Occasional complications and side effects
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Severe scarring requiring later surgery, esp. after additional
: pregnancies
: Dropped uterus, esp. with additional pregnancies
: Pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication
: of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of
: pregnancies)
: Eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of
: death)
: Gestational diabetes
: Placenta previa
: Anemia (which can be life-threatening)
: Thrombocytopenic purpura
: Severe cramping
: Embolism (blood clots)
: Medical disability requiring full bed rest, frequently ordered during
: part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of
: either mother or baby
: Torn abdominal muscles
: Mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
: Serious infection and disease, e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis
: Hormonal imbalance
: Ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
: Broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
: Hemorrhage
: Refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
: Aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions, e.g. epilepsy
: is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug
: metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the
: number and frequency of seizures
: Severe post-partum depression and psychosis
: Some less common (and serious) complications
: Peripartum cardiomyopathy
: Cardiopulmonary arrest
: Magnesium toxicity
: Severe hypoxemia/acidosis
: Massive embolism
: increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
: Molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease (like a
: pregnancy-induced cancer)
: Malignant arrhythmia
: Circulatory collapse
: Placental abruption
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And as for Liberty, it's the same
as life, neither has more RIGHT to it than the other and since they
will be free of one another in 9 months it's a stalemate until the
birth allows them to go in different directions.
The issue exists now and will totally change if the pregnancy no
longer exists for any reason whatsoever.
Why should we give some stupid people a free pass on personal
responsibility?
What gives you the right to decide what is or is not taking personal
responsibility?
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
It is much like a criminal trial when the defendant dies before the
trial concludes. Do you continue to try a corpse?
If you want to put it that way, the first abortion is free, the second is
too as long as both parties submit to sterilization and are ineligible for
welfare and drug rehab funds for 12 months following the abortion.
Why put totally unrelated restrictions on someone for obtaining a
legal service?
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
It's NOT perfect, but then what is?
Blocking a simple and safe medical procedure is not the answer to much
of anything other than blind obstinance.
It's not a medical procedure. It's mass murder on a scale far above gun
violence. Abortion is a crime against humanity.
It is a simple, inexpensive, and safe medical procedure. It is not a
crime and I have shown how it cannot be murder.
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
BeamMeUpScotty
2020-02-14 08:20:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 12:17:17 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new
horror that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals
are supplying those women with counseling and a safe space and a
blanket and warm cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like
they do when those same women are voting for Hillary and Hillary
loses? Or do you suppose learning that your abortion doctor was a
doctor Frankenstein and your baby a victim that lingering,
preserved in some jar in a garage somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
I didn't say any different..... but Republicans in office didn't vote
to kill human life inside the uterus.
All human beings have been born alive.
Actually Babies are born dead when the umbilical gets wrapped around
heir neck. As I have said being born isn't what makes a human life
because it would NOT be born dead if it was not first alive in the uterus.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Can you give a reference to a
definition of human being that includes a fetus?
The unique DNA of a fetus decides if it's a human being. The fact it's
gestating makes no difference to science....
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Those were Democrats, right or wrong
they decided to do it regardless.
Right and wrong have no intrinsic values and will change from person
to person and over time.
Then why make laws? Just wait until there is a disagreement and have a
vote for that moment of the consensus at that moment in time to see if
one side of the fluid values that are changing too fast to put those
concepts down on paper, should have their freedom restricted to an 8x5
room that is locked for, the outside.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If you think you can justify your beliefs you can call yourself what
ever you want. I have no problem with you believing you're a
Republican but you have to know that just as believing that a human
life is disposable, you may be just as wrong believing you're a
Republican.
Or not. I support Trump, voted fro him, and have voted for
Republicans for over half a century but that does not mean I agree
with or support all of their positions. I have supported the Freedom
of Choice since long before 1973.
SO you support the human life inside the uterus, having a choice..... ;)
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Because most I have met, actually respect human life, and tend to
protect it.
Are humans an endangered species?
NOT the issue is it? Excuses for killing is NOT the issue because
according to the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, we
all have an unalienable right to life, liberty and the pursuit of free
stuff from the government, if that makes them happy.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
I don't say you have to be religious or believe everything that every
Republican believes, since I'm a QUASI Libertarian and I have no god,
or God has no interest in me. But I do believe in life, all of it.
As a Libertarian I don't agree with everything LIBERTARIAN so I tend
to be a Constitutional-Libertarian where I use what is Libertarian
that will work under this United States Constitution, and murdering a
human life just isn't Constitutional.
Only illegally killing a person is murder. It is not murder to kill
a fetus (except under certain restrictions) or any human tissue
sample.
The legalization of killing a fetus (human life) is unconstitutional and
grants permission that the United States doesn't have the DELEGATED
POWER to engage in. The JOB of the Government is to protect our RIGHTS.

To kill or allow a human life to be killed violates that constitutional
mandate to protect the rights of Americans, and our posterity are
recognized as Americans. Being born makes someone a citizen NOT a human
life. Because they were a human life from the point of conception.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Freedom and RIGHTS can only extend to a
point where they infringe on other people's freedom and RIGHTS.
How about the freedom and rights of the woman involved? After all she
is hers now and there is nothing potential or developing about that.
And she has an equal right to life and liberty.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the
RIGHT to LIFE, LIBERTY and the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS/Property are very
clearly what the Revolutionary War and the resulting Constitution were
based on.
That phrase was in the D of C and they were not included in the
Constitution at the obvious option of those who wrote the
Constitution.
The Bill of Rights says that they are in the Constitution.

Amendment V
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous
crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in
cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in
actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be
subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or
limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness
against himself, *nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property* ,
*without due process of law* ; nor shall private property be taken for
public use, without just compensation.

Due process would require that the fetus committed a crime or violated
someone's RIGHTS, otherwise the government has no due process to to
visit on the subject.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
While there is no guarantee of wealth or property, the guarantee that
LIFE and LIBERTY are ours is pretty clear, as long as ours doesn't
infringe on others.
Oh? our laws are based on the Constitution and none at all are based
upon the D of I. Where in the Constitution are life and liberty
guaranteed?
*nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property* , *without due process
of law*

Life and Liberty are NOT infringed without due process, where is the due
process in an abortion? What crime was committed, who's rights are being
violated?
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the baby in a uterus isn't infringing on the
life of the mother until she is dying.
: Death
: Abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
: Pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged
: former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers,
: associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and
: reduced quality of life)
: Scarring from episiotomy or c-section
: Increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
: Loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Embolism
: Temporary adverse effects
: Exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
: altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
: Nausea and vomiting
: Dizziness and light-headedness
: Bloating and attendant discomfort
: Hemmorhoids
: Cramps
: Acne and mild skin disorders
: Skin discoloration, particularly face and abdomen
: Mild to severe backache and strain
: Increased headaches
: Difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
: Increased urination and incontinence
: Breast pain and discharge
: Swelling of joints, and attendant discomfort or pain
: Difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
: Inability to take regular medications
: Shortness of breath
: Higher blood pressure
: Hair loss
: Tendency to anemia
: Infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
: (pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant
: women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
: Curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
: Hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
: Extreme pain on delivery
: Continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period, exacerbated if
: c-section (major surgery) is required, sometimes taking up to a full
: year to fully recover
: Occasional complications and side effects
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Severe scarring requiring later surgery, esp. after additional
: pregnancies
: Dropped uterus, esp. with additional pregnancies
: Pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication
: of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of
: pregnancies)
: Eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of
: death)
: Gestational diabetes
: Placenta previa
: Anemia (which can be life-threatening)
: Thrombocytopenic purpura
: Severe cramping
: Embolism (blood clots)
: Medical disability requiring full bed rest, frequently ordered during
: part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of
: either mother or baby
: Torn abdominal muscles
: Mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
: Serious infection and disease, e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis
: Hormonal imbalance
: Ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
: Broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
: Hemorrhage
: Refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
: Aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions, e.g. epilepsy
: is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug
: metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the
: number and frequency of seizures
: Severe post-partum depression and psychosis
: Some less common (and serious) complications
: Peripartum cardiomyopathy
: Cardiopulmonary arrest
: Magnesium toxicity
: Severe hypoxemia/acidosis
: Massive embolism
: increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
: Molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease (like a
: pregnancy-induced cancer)
: Malignant arrhythmia
: Circulatory collapse
: Placental abruption
The same kind of risk as sex and crossing a road.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And as for Liberty, it's the same
as life, neither has more RIGHT to it than the other and since they
will be free of one another in 9 months it's a stalemate until the
birth allows them to go in different directions.
The issue exists now and will totally change if the pregnancy no
longer exists for any reason whatsoever.
The abortion is a whole set of risks that can cause death.... why is
death or any of the rest bad when it's the baby but good when it's the
abortion doctor doing it?
Post by atheist
Why should we give some stupid people a free pass on personal
responsibility?
Post by Attila
It is much like a criminal trial when the defendant dies before the
trial concludes. Do you continue to try a corpse?
If you want to put it that way, the first abortion is free, the second is
too as long as both parties submit to sterilization and are ineligible for
welfare and drug rehab funds for 12 months following the abortion.
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
It's NOT perfect, but then what is?
Blocking a simple and safe medical procedure
Abortion is neither simple or safe.
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
is not the answer to much
of anything other than blind obstinance.
There are condoms and pills and IUD's all work different ways and in
combinations they can be 99% effective. There is no need for murder
when you can prevent the reason for the murder. If you believe that you
can prevent murders by banning guns then you should be abl to prevent
abortions by preventing the pregnancy. Perhaps women need to be
licensed in order to NOT be on at least two forms of birth control.
Post by atheist
It's not a medical procedure. It's mass murder on a scale far above gun
violence. Abortion is a crime against humanity.
YES USING LIBERAL-DEMOCRAT LOGIC it's akin to owning a gun because if
you don't have a uterus, no one can be killed in it just as Democrats
believe that if you don't have a gun no one can be killed with it.

But we know that Uterus' kill more human lives than guns do.... Nearly
a million 1,000,000 a year for 50 years.... while guns in America kill
around 30,000 and the bulk of those are accidents and suicides.

The obvious thing to do is use the Liberals logic to ban uterus' by
making them non operational and then licensing those who want to have a
child, along with a background check and a waiting period of 9 months
and a limit on how many kids can be loaded into a uterus....
--
That's Karma

*One man's Affirmative Action law is another man's Jim Crow law*
Attila
2020-02-14 12:56:47 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 03:20:33 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 12:17:17 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Attila
On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0500, BeamMeUpScotty
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by Scrape and suck
More than 2,400 fetuses found last year in the Illinois home of
one of the Midwest's most prolific abortion doctors will be
buried in Indiana Wednesday, officials said.
Indiana Attorney General Curtis Hill will preside over the mass
burial at Southlawn Cemetery in South Bend and later give an
update on the investigation into Dr. Ulrich Klopfer, and whether
anyone assisted him in moving the remains to his home in Crete,
Ill.
The service comes five months after relatives sorting through
Klopfer's belongings after his Sept. 3, 2019, death came across
2,246 sets of preserved fetal remains stacked floor to ceiling
in his garage. Later, 165 more were found in the trunk of a car
at a business where Klopfer kept several vehicles.
Klopfer, who was 79, performed tens of thousands of abortions
over 40 years, mainly in Indiana and often as the only abortion
doctor serving South Bend, Gary and Fort Wayne.
All the women that used his services must be dealing with the new
horror that their abortion has become. I wonder if the Liberals
are supplying those women with counseling and a safe space and a
blanket and warm cocoa and a puppy to pet.....? You know, like
they do when those same women are voting for Hillary and Hillary
loses? Or do you suppose learning that your abortion doctor was a
doctor Frankenstein and your baby a victim that lingering,
preserved in some jar in a garage somewhere in Indiana.
Democrats must be so proud.
BTW, I am a Republican.
I didn't say any different..... but Republicans in office didn't vote
to kill human life inside the uterus.
All human beings have been born alive.
Actually Babies are born dead when the umbilical gets wrapped around
heir neck. As I have said being born isn't what makes a human life
because it would NOT be born dead if it was not first alive in the uterus.
It wasn't a baby. It was a stillborn fetus.

This is a semantics argument - the term baby is so general it is
useless. Thanks to years of Gerber baby food ads it's use brings up a
mental picture of the label they use but a baby can be any age.

A 70 year old man can be a baby to his 90 year old mother.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Can you give a reference to a
definition of human being that includes a fetus?
The unique DNA of a fetus decides if it's a human being.
Please give a reference to where that is so defined.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
The fact it's
gestating makes no difference to science....
As far as the species is concerned (which is all that science can
determine) you are correct. But we are not talking about species
here. Science will make exactly the same determination of a wart, a
blood sample, a fetus, a 10 year old boy, a 50 year old man, or a 300
year old corpse. All are species human.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Those were Democrats, right or wrong
they decided to do it regardless.
Right and wrong have no intrinsic values and will change from person
to person and over time.
Then why make laws?
To govern the interaction of individuals in a society.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Just wait until there is a disagreement and have a
vote for that moment of the consensus at that moment in time to see if
one side of the fluid values that are changing too fast to put those
concepts down on paper, should have their freedom restricted to an 8x5
room that is locked for, the outside.
That might work for a few individuals but it quickly becomes too
cumbersome for very many people. Should we have a national referendum
for ever item considered by Congress?

I can think of many things which were considered right a few
generations ago but are considered wrong today. And vice versa. I
bet you can too.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If you think you can justify your beliefs you can call yourself what
ever you want. I have no problem with you believing you're a
Republican but you have to know that just as believing that a human
life is disposable, you may be just as wrong believing you're a
Republican.
Or not. I support Trump, voted fro him, and have voted for
Republicans for over half a century but that does not mean I agree
with or support all of their positions. I have supported the Freedom
of Choice since long before 1973.
SO you support the human life inside the uterus, having a choice..... ;)
It is generally understood that the definition of the word
'choice' when used in this context is shorthand for the
freedom of a pregnant woman to decide whether to complete
her pregnancy or to terminate it. Any attempt to expand the
usage of the word beyond this narrow definition is nothing
more than an attempt create a situation which can be argued
because no argument can be sustained within the original and
correct usage.

If you are speaking to a group of programmers and mention
the word 'bug' no one will assume you are speaking of
termites, and if you are playing golf you are not likely to
insist an eagle is a birdie even if they both have feathers.

Attempts to expand the word 'choice' as used here is a
transparent and pathetic ploy.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Because most I have met, actually respect human life, and tend to
protect it.
Are humans an endangered species?
NOT the issue is it? Excuses for killing is NOT the issue because
according to the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, we
all have an unalienable right to life, liberty and the pursuit of free
stuff from the government, if that makes them happy.
Exactly where does it say that in the Constitution? What the D of I
says is irrelevant since that was a political statement that outlined
the reasons for separation from England and is not the basis for any
law.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
I don't say you have to be religious or believe everything that every
Republican believes, since I'm a QUASI Libertarian and I have no god,
or God has no interest in me. But I do believe in life, all of it.
As a Libertarian I don't agree with everything LIBERTARIAN so I tend
to be a Constitutional-Libertarian where I use what is Libertarian
that will work under this United States Constitution, and murdering a
human life just isn't Constitutional.
Only illegally killing a person is murder. It is not murder to kill
a fetus (except under certain restrictions) or any human tissue
sample.
The legalization of killing a fetus (human life) is unconstitutional and
grants permission that the United States doesn't have the DELEGATED
POWER to engage in. The JOB of the Government is to protect our RIGHTS.
Our laws don't legalize anything because we start from the position
that all actions are legal unless specifically prohibited by law. The
federal position on abortion resulted from the existence of a variety
of state laws that the Supreme Court held collectively restricted a
fundamental right held by every pregnant woman.

Laws can be passed placing conditional restrictions as outlined in R v
W but no general law banning all abortions can be passed.

Note that laws against homicide and murder do not prohibit killing but
restrict the conditions under which killing is allowed. I am free to
kill a burglar in my home at any time under the laws of my state.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
To kill or allow a human life to be killed violates that constitutional
mandate to protect the rights of Americans, and our posterity are
recognized as Americans.
Wrong, as outlined above.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Being born makes someone a citizen NOT a human
life. Because they were a human life from the point of conception.
We are not talking about a human life. A fetus is obviously alive and
is species human. A tissue sample can be alive and species human. Is
a wart a person?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Freedom and RIGHTS can only extend to a
point where they infringe on other people's freedom and RIGHTS.
How about the freedom and rights of the woman involved? After all she
is hers now and there is nothing potential or developing about that.
And she has an equal right to life and liberty.
Is she required to provide her body against her will to be a life
support system fro what you call another person? Is she required to
risk her health and her life against her will?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the
RIGHT to LIFE, LIBERTY and the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS/Property are very
clearly what the Revolutionary War and the resulting Constitution were
based on.
That phrase was in the D of C and they were not included in the
Constitution at the obvious option of those who wrote the
Constitution.
The Bill of Rights says that they are in the Constitution.
Give a specific reference to a specific section of the Constitution
that addresses "the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of
happiness".

The exact amendment and the exact portion of that amendment.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Amendment V
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous
crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in
cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in
actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be
subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or
limb;
Addresses double jeopardy.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness
against himself, *nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property* ,
*without due process of law*
Due process clause. It does not say anyone has those rights, it
restricts the loss of those rights where they may exist.

Is a prison inmate guaranteed the right to liberty?


; nor shall private property be taken for
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
public use, without just compensation.
Due process would require that the fetus committed a crime or violated
someone's RIGHTS, otherwise the government has no due process to to
visit on the subject.
Does a cow have a right not to be eaten? A fetus is not a legal
individual and can take no independent action of any kind. Your
argument is silly.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
While there is no guarantee of wealth or property, the guarantee that
LIFE and LIBERTY are ours is pretty clear, as long as ours doesn't
infringe on others.
Oh? our laws are based on the Constitution and none at all are based
upon the D of I. Where in the Constitution are life and liberty
guaranteed?
*nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property* , *without due process
of law*
That does not establish them as rights. It says if they exist there
are restrictions on removing them.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Life and Liberty are NOT infringed without due process, where is the due
process in an abortion? What crime was committed, who's rights are being
violated?
A fetus has no rights. It is not a legal individual and is physically
incapable of taking any independent action of any kind.

How about the rights of the woman involved, who does exist legally and
can take independent action and make personal decisions?
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And the baby in a uterus isn't infringing on the
life of the mother until she is dying.
: Death
: Abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
: Pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged
: former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers,
: associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and
: reduced quality of life)
: Scarring from episiotomy or c-section
: Increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
: Loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Embolism
: Temporary adverse effects
: Exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
: altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
: Nausea and vomiting
: Dizziness and light-headedness
: Bloating and attendant discomfort
: Hemmorhoids
: Cramps
: Acne and mild skin disorders
: Skin discoloration, particularly face and abdomen
: Mild to severe backache and strain
: Increased headaches
: Difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
: Increased urination and incontinence
: Breast pain and discharge
: Swelling of joints, and attendant discomfort or pain
: Difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
: Inability to take regular medications
: Shortness of breath
: Higher blood pressure
: Hair loss
: Tendency to anemia
: Infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
: (pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant
: women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
: Curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
: Hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
: Extreme pain on delivery
: Continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period, exacerbated if
: c-section (major surgery) is required, sometimes taking up to a full
: year to fully recover
: Occasional complications and side effects
: Temporary and permanent injury to back
: Severe scarring requiring later surgery, esp. after additional
: pregnancies
: Dropped uterus, esp. with additional pregnancies
: Pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication
: of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of
: pregnancies)
: Eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of
: death)
: Gestational diabetes
: Placenta previa
: Anemia (which can be life-threatening)
: Thrombocytopenic purpura
: Severe cramping
: Embolism (blood clots)
: Medical disability requiring full bed rest, frequently ordered during
: part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of
: either mother or baby
: Torn abdominal muscles
: Mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
: Serious infection and disease, e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis
: Hormonal imbalance
: Ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
: Broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
: Hemorrhage
: Refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
: Aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions, e.g. epilepsy
: is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug
: metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the
: number and frequency of seizures
: Severe post-partum depression and psychosis
: Some less common (and serious) complications
: Peripartum cardiomyopathy
: Cardiopulmonary arrest
: Magnesium toxicity
: Severe hypoxemia/acidosis
: Massive embolism
: increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
: Molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease (like a
: pregnancy-induced cancer)
: Malignant arrhythmia
: Circulatory collapse
: Placental abruption
The same kind of risk as sex and crossing a road.
If you are hit by a car when crossing a road should you be allowed
medical care?

Sex is a legal act that does not always result in pregnancy and
frequently is not intended to result in pregnancy.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
And as for Liberty, it's the same
as life, neither has more RIGHT to it than the other and since they
will be free of one another in 9 months it's a stalemate until the
birth allows them to go in different directions.
The issue exists now and will totally change if the pregnancy no
longer exists for any reason whatsoever.
The abortion is a whole set of risks that can cause death....
It is the PREGNANCY that is the source of the medical risk, not the
abortion.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
why is
death or any of the rest bad when it's the baby but good when it's the
abortion doctor doing it?
If the woman voluntarily chooses to accept the risk that is an
entirely different situation from one in which she is forced to take
the risk because she is prevented from getting an abortion.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Why should we give some stupid people a free pass on personal
responsibility?
Post by Attila
It is much like a criminal trial when the defendant dies before the
trial concludes. Do you continue to try a corpse?
If you want to put it that way, the first abortion is free, the second is
too as long as both parties submit to sterilization and are ineligible for
welfare and drug rehab funds for 12 months following the abortion.
Post by Attila
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
It's NOT perfect, but then what is?
Blocking a simple and safe medical procedure
Abortion is neither simple or safe.
Of course it is. It is an outpatient procedure and while no medical
procedure is totally safe it is safe enough not to require
hospitalization.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
Post by Attila
is not the answer to much
of anything other than blind obstinance.
There are condoms and pills and IUD's all work different ways and in
combinations they can be 99% effective. There is no need for murder
when you can prevent the reason for the murder.
We are not talking about was to prevent a pregnancy. That is a
different conversation and seldom a point of controversy except for
some religious lunatics that are control freaks. The discussion is
about a woman who is ALREADY pregnant.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
If you believe that you
can prevent murders by banning guns then you should be abl to prevent
abortions by preventing the pregnancy. Perhaps women need to be
licensed in order to NOT be on at least two forms of birth control.
Again, that is not the subject.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
Post by atheist
It's not a medical procedure. It's mass murder on a scale far above gun
violence. Abortion is a crime against humanity.
YES USING LIBERAL-DEMOCRAT LOGIC it's akin to owning a gun because if
you don't have a uterus, no one can be killed in it just as Democrats
believe that if you don't have a gun no one can be killed with it.
That was not my comment and I fail to see how a political party can be
a component of the situation.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
But we know that Uterus' kill more human lives than guns do.... Nearly
a million 1,000,000 a year for 50 years.... while guns in America kill
around 30,000 and the bulk of those are accidents and suicides.
Disease and age related problems will kill a lot more than that. Yet
humans do not appear to be an endangered species.
Post by BeamMeUpScotty
The obvious thing to do is use the Liberals logic to ban uterus' by
making them non operational and then licensing those who want to have a
child, along with a background check and a waiting period of 9 months
and a limit on how many kids can be loaded into a uterus....
I fail to see how politics is any pare of this issue.

Perhaps you would prefer laws requiring every woman to have as many
children as possible and make it illegal for a woman who is physically
capable of being pregnant not to be pregnant at any time, regardless
of any other considerations?
--
Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

There are three despicable occupations:
Pimps
Politicians
Priests

National Socialist American Worker's Party
formally known as the Democratic Party.

Every illegal alien is a criminal.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
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